Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: Foreign.
[00:00:10] Speaker B: Hello and welcome to the Digital Kindness Podcast. My name is Andrew Marcinik and I'm so glad you are here today. We welcome Greg Bagby to the pod. Greg, welcome. It's great to have you here with us.
[00:00:24] Speaker A: Thank you, thank you. Glad to be here. Glad to be able to share with you.
[00:00:28] Speaker B: Excellent, excellent.
So I'm going to talk a little bit about Gregor. He's got a great background bio in this space. He's somebody that I followed for quite some time and he is a big influencer and does it in a really great, humble way in the edtech space. So Greg is listed as one of the district Administration magazine's top 100 influencers in education for 2024.
Greg is currently the coordinator of. I know it's hard to hear that sometimes you're like, man, yeah, like you need one of those I'm kind of a big deal shirts, Craig. Oh, okay.
[00:01:07] Speaker A: I'll do that.
[00:01:08] Speaker B: All right. All right.
Greg is currently the coordinator of Instructional technology for Hamilton County Schools in Chattanooga, Tennessee.
In his 31 years in education, he served as a classroom teacher, building administrator, adjunct professor, and professional learning specialist before moving into his current role. So Greg has seen education from a variety of lenses, which is. We always love to have those perspectives here on the pod. He's a fixture of many EdTech conferences. I've seen Greg's work at ISTE and FTC. He's a speaker all over the country. If you haven't had a chance to see him speak, hit subscribe to this POD first and then go see him at one of your local conferences.
He presents a lot around technology and leadership and he's also served as a 2024 in 2024 working group for the National EdTech Plan, or as us in the know call it, the netp.
So, Greg, welcome to the pod. I'm glad you're here and I'm glad we're able to talk and share some. Some insight on where education's going today.
[00:02:15] Speaker A: Yeah, I hope my insight's valuable to, well, if not one listener, at least you.
I hope someone gets some insight out of this.
[00:02:24] Speaker B: Yeah, no, I think so.
I've really been following a lot of your work around. I mean, you're doing some really great work around AI and ed tech. So we're going to get to all of that today.
But I just want to start kind of talking about your day to day.
You know, you were. You spend your day in schools working to implement technology effectively. Can you talk about what you're seeing now in schools and what schools should be focused on as they end the school year. And a lot of us in education are starting to plan already for the 25, 26 school year.
[00:02:59] Speaker A: Well, I'm seeing a lot, I'm seeing a lot of things where teachers are latching onto this AI tool or that AI tool.
And if the districts haven't done it yet, I think they need to plan effective AI training for their staff because AI has been around for a couple years, but it's still the hot thing. The hype cycle hasn't fallen off yet and there's still more tools. It seems like, okay, it slowed down a whole lot, but it seems like there's a new tool or a new thing. I was just on a call prior to this with some folks from Gemini in Google and they were talking about the Google workspace for schools and the things they're implementing and how pretty soon they didn't say when, but they're going to announce Gemini usage for students under the age of 13. Apparently they're supposed to be a big announcement, but knowing how to use those things and how to use them effectively and how to understand what they're sharing or not sharing or should be sharing with these AI platforms, that's what I want folks to start thinking about so that when they're starting the year off they can go in talking about AI literacy and digital literacy and digital citizenships and making sure that students and teachers are safely onboarding or safely getting on this road of using these tools more effectively.
Yes, we had a lot of tool usage through the pandemic. A lot of people went running back to the way things were prior to pandemic once it was over.
But I think we, we've forgotten the fact that yes, I understand you get a cell phone and you don't read the manual and you don't go to training. However, these things are different. We're trying to create digital learners out of these digital natives, so called.
So of course the folks in charge need to be digitally literate so that we can make that transformation.
So basically I all that to say I want teachers to try to dig in a little bit deeper and see what's going on with AI so that when they are introducing it into the classroom next year, it would be a seamless transition from the knowledge they have into what's going on.
Some districts are, are outpacing the country at very quick speed. I think of Pinellas, is it Penelope, the Peninsula up in Seattle, in that area? Yeah, Peninsula with Chris Hagel and he's doing Some amazing work up there.
Well, thanks to OSPI pushing out some of the AI guidance which some states are doing great things. But then there's pockets of, well, states, whole states and pockets of school communities that haven't even touched AI yet.
But they're waiting for the sign I guess to get it rolled out.
[00:06:00] Speaker B: Yeah, no, I, a lot, a lot of unpack there and I think yeah, Washington State was one of the, one of the first states to really kind of launch that guidance that a lot of states had done last summer going into the school year. And so I think it's, it's great to look at those. If you are a state that doesn't have AI guidance yet or if you're just a school that's kind of looking for guidance, that's a great place to start, kind of looking at what other states are doing.
But you brought up something really important I just want to touch upon is you talk about, I think yes, teachers and schools need to be having conversations about AI. If you haven't already, you need to start, make it a priority because it's here, it's happening and it's not gonna, it's not a bad, it's not a trend, it's not gonna just go away.
And we've been here before. We were here with web 2.0 and we were here with, you know, a lot of the Google conversations and one to one programming and now we're here with AI and I, I think the one important things you said is that we need to teach both teachers and students how to use this tool safely.
You know, I've done a lot of reflecting on my work in, in ed tech and, and the space I've been in. And you know, I think that's one of the things I've in my own way of said I could have done better bringing in a one to one program or I should have done more training or I should have done this. And I don't want us to have that make those same mistakes with AI because I think we're at a really interesting point here in education where we can really get this right. And I think we need to do almost everything you said. It's just like just dip your toes in the water, you know, you don't have to go all in.
This isn't a race to see who can be the best school with AI. It's about really collaborating and sharing, looking at what other districts are doing and starting to implement as early as this year. We should be having those conversations because we all know Kids are out there using AI.
And I think that's kind of where we look at what happened with social media and how that kind of escalated into the Surgeon General Report of 2023, where it said all. All these things that are happening in the last 15 years that have caused mental health issues with students and identity issues and a lot of that.
We looked at that report and we're like, oof, boy, we could have done better there.
[00:08:22] Speaker A: Yeah, we missed the boat.
[00:08:23] Speaker B: Yeah, we did. And I think that's where I agree. That's where I think we.
In our space, Greg, we've done. I think a lot of us have done a lot of reflecting on that and are thinking of. Of this next generation of students that we need to make sure they're in a good place to learn AI and to really leverage it to do really great things.
Because it's not replacing jobs. It's going to be the kids that are going to thrive are those who can work alongside AI effectively in their space.
[00:08:53] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:08:55] Speaker B: So I just want to shift gears a little bit. In my book, Teaching Digital Kindness, I make a strong case that we need to do more in our schools. This goes along to what you were just talking about, to teach students how to use technology mindfully, intentionally, and creatively in your work.
How are you seeing schools approach this idea?
And if you have any examples, that would be great.
[00:09:20] Speaker A: Well, sadly, I haven't seen a lot of the whole idea of being mindful, even with the technology.
I know it sounds kind of crazy.
You wrote a whole book on it, what, two years ago and folks still have. Yeah, it's. It's an idea. Well, that's separate. This. There's still a separation between the use of the technology and then the way this human feels or the way that things go. And. Oh, but then they say, oh, well, don't get on your phone because of depression and anxiety and sell social media.
Okay. But we have these kids on devices in our classrooms. We should be thinking about this the same way.
When I was a principal, I made sure that before my teachers got a card of Chromebooks or Apples or whatever they were pushing around the school, they had to go through a digital citizenship course.
And I taught that digital citizenship course because I wanted to make sure that they understood the ramifications of just letting kids get on and finding things and seeing things about. Well, I used to teach a course in Getting Back to the cart. A course. And I think. I can't think of the lady's name. It slipped my mind, but she wrote an Article called Girls Worms and Body Image. And it just talks about how girls latch onto body image things and how it's upsetting, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. But I would tell my teachers, I don't want folks feeling bad because of what they're finding online. I don't want folks feeling depressed because, oh, I see this person and they have this, this and this. And no, I wanted them to think about the usage of the technology, understanding that these kids, they're going to go to some of these sites, they're going to go to some of these things, but we need to prepare them for what they're going to see. Just like, I know we're not parents, but just like you would when you take your kid to. Well, back in the 70s or 80s, when you take your kid to a PG movie, you thought everything was just fine. And back then they didn't have PG13, so things were really, really, really crazy. But just being able to prepare those students for what they may encounter and help them navigate that school should be a safe space for them to navigate some of those hard things and all that to say, I'm not seeing it as much as I would like.
[00:11:45] Speaker B: Right.
[00:11:46] Speaker A: And it's heartbreaking to see kids that.
Well, just the things, the effects that some of this stuff is having on students.
And we have prime time to help those students out in our school buildings. But we need to make sure that we have our two hours for math and our hour and a half for literacy and blah, blah, blah.
Let's take some time just to be mindful or just work on the whole child. I know we're not counselors, but come on, guys. Sorry.
Yeah, you put me on a little bit of a soapbox. I'm sorry.
[00:12:21] Speaker B: Yeah, it's like, no, no problem. That's, that's the play, that's the, this is the place for soapboxing. You're all good. And I, and I agree. Greg. I think you're right. I haven't seen it too much either myself. And you know, I think I, I love your analogy of the movies of the 70s and 80s because I remember my dad took me to see Ghostbusters when I was like 5 or 6. And he thought it was going to be this fun movie that his son would enjoy seeing. And I didn't sleep for weeks after that.
I still have nightmares about the ghost in the library. So that kind of hit me a different way. But you're right, I think parents send their kids to school and they want kids to be able to. They want this to be a safe space so they can learn about technology can be this really great thing for all of us. And it can be an equalizer in some cases.
Um, but it's in, in, in some cases though, if, if it's just, if it's just going into a classroom and kids lifting the lid of their laptop up and then putting their heads down for an hour, you know, that's not really understanding how to mindfully, creatively and intentionally use technology. That's just passively doing what a lot of kids are already doing once they leave school. You know, they're going on a phone or they're going on an iPad and they're, they're finding themselves going down some rabbit hole of YouTube where it's just endless content, you know, and I talked with, you know, or actually I listened to a podcast about a month ago now with, with Ezra Klein and, and Jonathan Haidt and they were talking about how, you know, we shouldn't be letting our kids get anywhere near YouTube because it's just this like infinite end of content that just never ends. It's a vicious circle. Inspirable. I find myself going down these holes myself. You know, I was look, you look for one thing and then next thing you, you start out looking for one thing and then you're on to like, you know, how to replace the oil in my car, you know, like two hours y.
And so, yeah, I think there's a lot more we can do. And I think especially with AI coming on board into the conversation in schools, I think we should be having these conversations. I liken it to the idea of kind of the nostalgia aspect of it is we weren't just given keys to the car when we turned 16 back in the day. We had to go through. I went through a driver's ed program in my school as part of my health class. And, and then I got my permit. And so it was this process and I think you're onto something. I like the way you were approaching teaching teachers about it. Like they had to earn this kind of digital citizenship badge to be able to use it or the kids would need to be able to use it.
And I think that's important and it's a piece we miss that we don't have to recreate this with just pull out classroom technology classes. We can embed these skills and these things because technology is used across all content areas all day, every day. So I think we need to be doing more there. And I love that you were kind of already doing this way back when so it's good to hear.
I want to switch gears a little bit to AI. I recently saw a quote you engaged with on LinkedIn and it said the new digital divide isn't computers, it's AI training. Can you speak a little bit to about kind of why you engaged with this and just kind of what this means to you? Because I agree 100%. I think there's a lot AI can do and I think if we're missing out on the training, we're also missing out on giving kids a big advantage in their day to day in their life.
[00:15:51] Speaker A: Yes. So like you said earlier, technology can be a game changer. They can equalize the playing field for many.
And I think the digital, I think about the digital divide not only because the last netp but also I'm trying to do this PhD thing, I don't know, dissertation, that's what they call that paper. And my dissertation's on the digital divide.
But because of the pandemic and things that occurred during the pandemic and fallout after that and what we've learned.
But as I've been traveling, yes, I was a professional learning specialist while I was in my position here in the district, so they gave me release time, so to speak, where I did some Apple coaching and training for those folks and also for ncce. But while I did that, I'm out and about from Butte, Montana to Clearwater, Florida, just working with different districts and I see folks that are not touching it and I see how their students are already getting behind because they're not embracing. Not that everyone has to embrace AI and fall in love with it, just the fact that kids need to know about it. Like you said, it's here. And I think that the lack of teaching and training in AI is making this chasm, this digital divide chasm even wider.
I think about the schools here in Tennessee where I was at a conference in October and one superintendent was like, yeah, we've turned off everything that could do AI. We're not going to do no school AI. We're not going to get no chat GPT. He was going on and on about all these things that they're not going to do. And I was like, but the kids already have access to it. No, they don't. Well, on their telephones.
And it's one of those, of course we can't block or ban our way out of it. However, if we're not going to step up and help our teachers understand it a little bit better or understand it a little bit more, we're doing them a disservice as well as our students. A disservice.
So yeah, I'm just, I guess I, I go back to thinking of my kids. I have a couple of kids, they're both college kids or something like that, I don't know.
But they have never known a time in their life where they didn't come home or come home where they didn't have access to a laptop and wireless computing in their home.
[00:18:27] Speaker B: Right.
[00:18:28] Speaker A: So my kids have always had that and for the last 10 years or so they've had gigabit Internet. So it's one of those things where I know that it's possible to have all these tools and how to manage and mold the kids. I think my kids are pretty good so far. My daughter's headed to dental school after teaching for a couple of years and my son's a engineering major at Georgia Tech. So I think they both are doing okay in that sense.
But it's one of those things where we gotta guide them or they're gonna get left behind. I know no child left behind. I'm sorry I brought that up, but I think this AI is creating this divide where more and more students are getting left behind and no fault of their own just because of the ideas and aspects of some of the leaders. How they're not forward thinking enough to say, hey, perhaps we should jump on this. The World Economic Forum, they talked about it, they talked about it on CNN and MSNBC as well as Fox News. All of them have talked about AI. Maybe we should do something about it. Sorry, that's another soapbox. See you do this to me.
[00:19:45] Speaker B: Hey man, no need to apologize or anything you're saying. I think you're, I think you're spot on and I think you're, I think you're exactly right. I mean we're, we can't be leaving kids behind. And you know, that's, that's what's happening if we're, if we're just ignoring it. And it's the, it's the problem I've always had with, you know, when you hear about schools going towards these, these cell phone bands, it's something, if you ask me right off the cuff.
My daughter, when she goes to school, does she need a cell phone in school, in her classroom? No. But would I like the school to be able to teach her some skills on how to manage a Device effectively in 20, 25 and beyond? Yeah, I'd love that. That's what I would love to spend my tax dollars on because I think we. And as. And as adults, we have the same problem where I think we just. We've gone down, you know, this, this rabbit hole, and it's. It's hard to put the toothpaste back in the tube. And. And, you know, we're here. So we need to think about how we're going to educate the next generation of kiddos to kind of navigate these digital spaces. Because, you know, I was talking with Adam, Adam Feil a few weeks ago, and, you know, he said, well, in one other industry, do they call their.
Do they call their people who use their product users? And he's like, well, drug dealers. And so it's like, it's kind of like that thing when you go to the grocery store and you're trying to eat healthy and you're starting to look at all the labels, then you realize that the cards are stacked against us. And it's hard the same way. Like Apple and Google and do not want us to not use their phones. And Comcast and Verizon and AT&T don't want. They want us to use their network.
[00:21:29] Speaker A: All day, every day.
[00:21:30] Speaker B: So they have their stake in this game. So we need to kind of do better and realize that we're all in this because we're all kind of in that space where we're just like, I need my phone or I just need to scroll or I need to access it.
And so I think starting with that, and especially in the age of AI, like, we need to train our teachers on how to bring these skills and competencies into the classroom.
So, yeah, I'm with you, man. You hit on a lot of really good pieces there. And I just want to kind of expand a little bit about what you talked about earlier on AI and what schools should be doing. So as we kind of are at the end of the school year calendar, can you talk about what you're experiencing now in your school and. And how schools should be preparing for AI conversations and implementations this fall when they come back?
[00:22:26] Speaker A: Well, we're doing things a little bit differently here in Hamilton County Schools. We actually are working with Education first, and they're working with, I think, 12 districts across the country, and they had a little grant to where teachers can.
Or the folks involved in the districts using this grant that could help, I guess, generate AI tools and. Or AI learning or AI teaching. And we are, for ours, we decided that we wanted to make sure that the teachers are using AI in a way that helps them. So we did this AI Sprint and I'll be Checking in with some teachers actually this evening.
And teachers are creating apps, as in, we said, okay, if you want to be a part of this, come to a meeting. They came to a meeting and then they gave applied with some ideas. Hey, I want to do this, do that, do this. We took like top five ideas and we said, okay, we're going to give you a stipend to help you formulate these into actual products so that we can launch August 1st at our big district wide PD.
So we have teachers that are actually learning how to create, I guess you can call them their own GPT, so to speak, or their own bots, or their own gyms, their own agents so that they could share with other folks in the district and teach them how to use these AI tools effectively.
So that's what we are doing. And like I said, I know there are 10 other or 11 other districts that are working through the summer to make sure that the teachers understand no and use AI effectively and purposefully when they get to the classroom.
For those schools that are not doing things like that, I strongly suggest that if they don't have a group working with AI in their district to think about forming one before everyone's gone home and allow those folks to learn a little bit.
I, I think of all the folks who have AI training from ISTE to Google to Microsoft, I was just on one, a play lab. They have an AI training thing going on and AI and Edu, there's like several and I think most of them are free. Yeah, several places where they can get some AI training for educators, specifically for educators. And it shows them how to use it in their classroom.
Yes, of course, whatever. If you go to Microsoft, it's going to be bent towards Copilot and Google's been towards Gemini and NotebookLM. But these are nice spaces to go into and start learning about the products and learning about the different things. Even I believe Magic School AI and brisk teaching in School AI. I believe they also have training that teachers could do. And I would strongly suggest that if your school hasn't adopted anything or your district hasn't adopted anything, to be curious, I know summer's break and all that stuff, but be curious about what you could do with the AI tools in your school and look some up and look up some of their free training so that you'll learn more and you can grow yourself and your students.
So that's one of the things I would suggest. Be curious, find some specific trainings, even Common Sense Edu or Common Sense Media. Or is it just Common sense education. Now I don't remember, but they even have some AI training that you could go through and get a little certificate or a badge or something. But I believe that's one of the things they should do. Well, step number one, find your tribe, your people, your group that's going to help you get through this AI stuff, district level, school level, whatever it may be. And then number two, figure out what training you could take part in so you can learn more so that you can develop this program for your school, for your district or whomever.
And then like you said, or like we decided earlier, you don't have to jump in full tilt. You can take one step at a time. As I like I would tell my teachers or whomever when you're learning. When like the pandemic happened and we had all these tools, just find one, start with that one and if you want to add another, great. Same thing with these AI tools, start with one. If your school district has like Google Workspace, start with Gemini or if they have Microsoft, start with Copilot and just start with or even Adobe because that's free, as well as Canva for educators.
They both have trainings on AI as well. So I guess that's educate yourselves this summer. That's what you should be doing.
[00:27:13] Speaker B: I love it. I love it. And you know, I think, you know, step one, be curious and step two, there's plenty of resources out there to, you know, engage with. Like you said, there's, if you're, if you're a Google school, there's Gemini stuff out there. There's certificate programs you can go through, there's resources for educators. And it's like, I think that's the big change I've seen from, you know, when we started seeing ChatGPT and just a lot of these AI tools come about is that in this kind of third year of AI existence, we're starting to see a lot more resources specifically for school. How do you teach, how do you bring these tools into the kids spaces at different levels?
[00:28:00] Speaker A: And you said since I guess the 3 years, it started with ChatGPT when they pushed it out, you can even go to the OpenAI or is it ChatGPT site? I guess it's OpenAI site and they have training for teachers now. They do have an education department that's building these trainings. So.
[00:28:17] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, no, and it's, it's great. There's, there's no shortage of resources. And so I think that's right. I think it's, it's to Kind of find your tribe, find your space, you know, collaborate with somebody, pull somebody together within your department and say, like, hey, let's, let's explore this and let's, you know, expectations are we explore first and then we think about maybe implementing one thing or trying one thing next year, and then we build upon that, share that out, and that's what we need to do. Like, we don't have to do this alone. It's 2025. We can all connect and share these resources. And I'm certain that ISTE will be chock full of resources again this summer in San Antonio. So, I mean, that's another great spot. They've put on a lot of great resources. So please check those out and find them.
So I want to kind of shift to something that is near and dear to my heart, which is the National EdTech Plan.
I was at the Department of Ed during the launch of the 2016 National EdTech Plan. And you were involved in the working group for the 2024 plan.
Can you talk? This is a really amazing thing. I mean, just to be included in that document and have, you know, your voice in that space, I think really is a testament, Greg, to your, your work and what you have done in your career.
Can you talk and, and share a little bit about work, your working experience on this very important document, and then just maybe we can segue into, you know, now that this document is no longer on a website that you can easily access with a lot of great resources about AI and, and tech and all these things.
What are some space, what are some places that, you know, teachers and school leaders can look now in, in the kind of the absence of these documents being prominent.
[00:30:09] Speaker A: Well, thank you for that. I appreciate, I guess, the things that you said about how I, I guess, found myself onto the National Edict plant. I don't know if you were at the unveiling, so to speak, at FETC or was it ISTI in 2016? I don't know.
One of them, Zach Chase was there and I met him for the first time. And I think because of that, and Susan Bearden and Katrina Stevens, I was at one of the conferences with them, and they were like, hey, you should do this for us at the next one. I think I was at ISTE and I talked with them for FETC or vice versa, but I think that's how I actually got involved with this because I, when they were talking about it at one of those conferences, I was very interested and, and it was actually, I did not expect.
Well, I didn't expect to be invited to work with the folks, but I didn't expect the volume of materials that they would do. And they were everyone that did the work. It was really thorough work. We had listening tours.
I went to one of the listening groups at ASU GSB in San Diego. Before we went to publish, I was in a listening group in Chicago at. Was it ideacon? I don't know, somewhere. But it was amazing how they would go and listen, take notes, and then we would gather the notes and then sift through the notes and figure out what's great and what needs to be shared and what voices we could pull out from the country and share with everyone else. And then we had this moment where they said, okay, so we want specific stories from every state. Each of the 50 states, we need specific stories.
And they just opened that up to the group of us. I don't know, there maybe 10 of us. And we were all able to connect with someone at one state to get a really significant story about digital use divide or digital access divide or all those divides and how folks are working with that and working through that and building it up. And I. I was very surprised that we were able to get one for all 50 states. And, yeah, that was the other word. I was very impressed with the work that went on in order to create that document and the pull how.
How we pull from so many other folks in order to make sure that happened. So.
So of course, the National EdTech Plan has kind of disappeared off the Department of Education website.
I know. Who knew?
But.
Yeah, yeah, but I know that there's some friends that were actually there for the unveiling in D.C. and I guess it was like a little over a year ago, which is crazy.
I got to do a panel there on the national plan that was really cool going to the White House and all that. But the group. There's a group from ceta.
If you go to ceta, it's State Educational Technology something, something, I think. I don't know what CEDAR stands for, but I know they have it on their website. They have the national edtech plan there.
And I. And I believe CO did the same thing. Several groups pulled it and said, hey, I understand that the government's taking it down. So this is where it is. Same thing with the AI guidance that Ishmael created, which was a part of the Office of EdTech, which I'm not sure if that office exists anymore, but the Office of Ed Tech pushed out some really great stuff.
And the thing is, you have to actually search and look for the things that were once, hey, it's a government document. Click, click. Here it is. Now, it takes a little while to get to it, but I. Like I said, I don't see that has it. I believe Cosin has it, and there's a couple of other entities.
But the crazy thing about finding the National EdTech Plan is there are a couple other countries that actually have it on their websites for education saying, oh, by the way, this is what the US Had.
Yeah.
So it's kind of embarrassing. Kind of not. I don't know.
[00:34:38] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. No, I mean, that's great. And it's so that's. And it's really cool to hear that you got to go to the White House and the eob. It's. It's a really amazing experience to kind of go through that whole process to be on the ground. And, you know, if you've ever watched the show the West Wing, you just feel like you're. You're in an episode and you just. You see people walking around around like that, and it's just. It's wild how accurate that show actually was.
[00:35:04] Speaker A: Yes.
Looking for Toby. Where's Toby?
[00:35:07] Speaker B: Where's Toby? Right.
Yeah, no, it's. It's. It's really great. And. Yeah, no, I think you're right. I think, like, organizations like COSIN and CETA can't say enough about their resources. They've kind of become the default to go to. I think in this time where, you know, the education department is. Has gone through a dramatic transformation, you know, since. Since January. So, you know, we hope it can get back on track and focusing on the. The students and things that matter. But it's also really great to hear that our NETP is. Is in or has international pool as well, because it's.
That was one of the things, is that, you know, when I was at the department, the things that we were putting out, we were.
We wanted everyone to have access to it. We wanted everyone to be like a tech director in Iowa, to be able to grab this thing and pull from it and be able to support their rural school district.
And I think that's what we're missing is that the documents weren't just for the big districts around the world or even the people who are at the eeob. It's for every school district, and we really focus in. I love that you said that every.
Every state had a voice in this document, and I think that's important to understand that, again, this is for everyone. This isn't just for a select Few. And hopefully we can get to a place in the education department or maybe even at the state and local level where we can start to push some of these resources out into our schools and our districts.
Greg, I want to ask one final question that I ask every guest on this show and it's probably the hardest question out there, but what strategy do you use to step away from the digital world?
[00:37:02] Speaker A: So I am plugged in all the time.
I even have on my metas, so I'm plugged in even on my face.
And yeah, I was really into the whole wearable tech a few years back. I remember this is not about being unplugged, but the whole idea of the Apple watch. My son was the first person I ever knew to own one because he was reffing soccer at the time and he bought an Apple watch and when he wore it to school, his school freaked out because they didn't know what to do with it.
[00:37:35] Speaker B: Right. They're like, wait a minute, what is that? Yeah, what's that?
[00:37:39] Speaker A: Yeah. But I am steeped in the tech all the time, like 247 until I step away.
And the thing that helps me, stepping away, I know it's like you can't step away if you're still tracking. Yeah, I do track my miles or my walk or my runs. But just getting outside and being physical, if it's, I don't know, playing in the garden or watching my wife and her parents play in the garden or.
Yeah, like my son and I, we went and played some rounds of disc golf just to get out and be physical, be active and. Or cooking. We enjoy cooking together.
We have lots of. We always do our meals together every evening. My in laws, they live upstairs so they come downstairs and a lot of times mom in law cooks which is great because cooking and well, I guess when I think of the activities that I said the garden and playing disc golf and cooking and sitting around the table, it's all about being with other people. We turn things off so that we could be with other people. And I'll, I'll say this, hopefully no one will see this and get report back. But yeah, before we moved in with our. No, before my in laws moved in with us. I'm not living with them, they're living with me. There's a difference. But we had this rule of no cell phones at the table because we didn't want or no devices or any device because we just want to sit down and have a conversation with the people.
So there's a couple of 80 year old. No, 70 year old. Sorry, 70 year old people that come sit down at dinner and they always have their phones and they're like, not the kids.
[00:39:26] Speaker B: Right, right, right.
[00:39:29] Speaker A: But no, I get it. They have access to anything that they can imagine. My father in law, he's a brilliant man and he thinks about lots of things deeply and he loves to be able to pull out his phone and look it up immediately if we're having a conversation about, I don't know, the endocrine system. I don't know. My daughter's a science geek and she's like, I don't know, really weird and she talks about all sorts of things and he just wants to be in the know so he'll pull his phone out. And we had that rule about no cell phones at the table until they moved in. And then we just like, okay, so we're just gonna let them because they burned it, they can do whatever they want.
[00:40:06] Speaker B: Right, right. No, and I love that though. I love the idea of, of kind of the generational connection too, through conversation. I mean, it's, it's one of those things that I think we have to, we have to step back and actually think about it, you know, you know, your kids are experiencing living history around, around their grandparents and that's, that's important. And I think sometimes we get so caught up in the devices and it's like, oh, I can just look this stuff up about, you know, this period in time. But to have that conversation is such a, such a powerful thing. And you know, someone who I haven't, I haven't had grandparents in, you know, almost 10, 12 years. And you know, I think back to like all the time I didn't go spend time with them or didn't just actively engage and listen to their stories. Like I, if I could have that back for a second, it would be unbelievable.
[00:40:56] Speaker A: Yeah, totally get that.
[00:40:58] Speaker B: So.
Well, that is, that is really a good way to kind of end the show. And I think it's, it's really great to hear Greg, what you're doing and I think it's really awesome to see the work you're doing and to really promote mindful, intentional use of technology. I think it's, it goes without saying you are definitely an influencer in this, in this space and you're someone who should, people should look you up and they should follow your work. And again.
[00:41:29] Speaker A: Oh, thanks.
[00:41:31] Speaker B: Greg is going to be. Are you going to this year?
[00:41:34] Speaker A: You know, I wasn't planning on it, but things have changed in my district so I Am not that things are. Oh, things have changed in my district. Right. Actually, they have shifted. Some of the departments, like the department that I was ahead of, they put it under someone else. And I was like, that's nice, but I think I'm gonna walk away. So I. I will be at ISTI now because I'm gonna launch my own consulting, whatever business just because there's a lot of good work. And I love working in this district. I do. I grown a lot. They've sent me places.
But it's not that I've outgrown the district. There's just so much more that I can't do because I'm stuck in the district, if that makes any sense.
Yeah. And I want to get out and share. Share the wealth, I guess. Yeah. I'm one of those persons who wants all kids to, like, succeed. I don't care if they're in Texas or Tennessee.
I just want them all to grow and I want all the teachers to be amazing.
I sat in with this one person a long, long time ago.
You may have heard of her. Her name's Arena Pearson, if you don't know who that is. Yeah. I was in one of us. I was in a session with her when she came to Chattanooga for this other thing that she was doing. And she. Not only did she turn my. Turn the light on in my head, but the whole idea of, yes, every chill. Every child deserves a champion, but when she says every child, she means every child.
It doesn't matter.
And so that's my push as I step away from the district and step into this consultant. This is the first time I mentioned it, just so you know. So no one knows. It's. It hasn't even been LinkedIn official yet, so. Wow.
Yeah.
[00:43:24] Speaker B: We have an exclusive on. On. On the Digital Kindness pod. I love this. This is amazing.
[00:43:28] Speaker A: Yeah, there you go. Yeah. I'm stepping away from the district, and I'm gonna try to help others be amazing like you, sir.
[00:43:37] Speaker B: Awesome. Well, I appreciate that, Greg. And. And we look forward to following you in your new endeavor. I mean, we wish you the best. I think you're. You're definitely. You have that range and dynamic experience that, like, you know, we gotta. I gotta get you to. I gotta. We gotta get you to talk to as many schools as possible because I think your work is. Is profound and it's. It's. It needs to be shared across the board. So thank you again for being on the pod and again, look forward to following your work and all you do. Thank you, Greg.
[00:44:09] Speaker A: No, thank you. Thank you for the invite and thank you for having me on. And I hope to see you at iste.
[00:44:15] Speaker B: All right. Hopefully we'll see you there soon. I can't commit yet, but I'm kind of almost there. Okay.
All right, Greg. Thanks, buddy.
[00:44:24] Speaker A: Not a problem. Have a great day, Sam.
